this post was submitted on 14 Sep 2025
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Recent news revealed that Spotify’s CEO Daniel Ek has been investing heavily in military tech companies, which adds another ethical layer to a platform already criticized for how little it pays musicians !

Spotify only pays artists about $3–5 per 1,000 streams, using a pro-rata model that directs most money toward major stars... By contrast, Qobuz (≈$18–20 per 1,000 streams) and Tidal (≈$12–13) pay far more fairly!

However Tidal is far from ethical. Most of its revenue is controlled by private investors and founders and small artists still earn very little...

More fair-minded platforms like Bandcamp, Resonate, Ampled, or SoundCloud’s fan-powered royalties prioritize musicians over investors.

With these more ethical alternatives available, why do we keep using Spotify?

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[–] 30p87@feddit.org 64 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

Pirate and pay creators directly.
Pirating is the objectively best, most private and future proof user experience you're gonna get.

[–] Mihies@programming.dev 24 points 2 weeks ago (3 children)

Pirate and pay creators directly.

How does that even work?

[–] 30p87@feddit.org 31 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (13 children)

Contact them, ask for ways to donate. Until they publicly provide that info.

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[–] ober@lemmy.dbzer0.com 16 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Personally I do this by buying merch. If I buy a shirt from a band than not only do I get a cool shirt but the band also gets paid more in that single transaction than if I listened to their music 5000 times on spotify.

[–] Mihies@programming.dev 3 points 2 weeks ago (6 children)

Sure, but that doesn't give you rights to pirate their music, does it? There is also the problem who gets paid what when you buy their merch.

[–] ubergeek@lemmy.today 6 points 2 weeks ago (11 children)

Ask any artist: they make most of their money from merch and ticket sales (depending on venue).

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[–] thatsnothowyoudoit@lemmy.ca 25 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

It’s worse. My music is on Spotify - while I would no longer meet their minimum for payments, even before that change they refused to pay me or provide stats until I provided a twitter or Facebook page/IG page, none of which I have - despite publishing through an established publishing company who could absolutely handle payments and play stats.

Spotify is cancer.

[–] grrgyle@slrpnk.net 25 points 2 weeks ago (6 children)

I buy on Bandcamp Fridays, but am suspicious of that platform since they changed owners so often without any input from the community or musicians.

I'm keeping my eye on https://subvert.fm/ as a hopefully more democratic option.

[–] cityboundforest@beehaw.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

I've heard that Mirlo.space is a good alternative to Bandcamp, and as an artist myself, it looks to be a good replacement.

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[–] Powderhorn@beehaw.org 13 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

Old fart checking in ... why not just buy the tracks instead of paying for monthly access that screws artists? I mean, each song is unlikely to be more than $1.49, and then you own it. I don't have a streaming music account and never will because the idea of paying repeatedly for the same thing -- with the option of it being pulled at any time -- is nauseating.

[–] mcbenavides85@piefed.social 12 points 2 weeks ago (4 children)

An old fart listens to entire albums! Fake!

I’m an old fart.

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[–] Ulrich@feddit.org 6 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Why would I? Pay $1.49 to listen to 1 song over and over or pay $12 to listen to basically the entirety of human creation any time I want? Not to mention custom playlists and whatnot.

[–] Powderhorn@beehaw.org 6 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

My music collection spans some 1,700 tracks and several full albums. It's not difficult to create local playlists, I don't pay monthly, and I don't have an excessive data plan because I need streaming. Look at the knock-on costs. It's not $12/month.

[–] Ulrich@feddit.org 5 points 2 weeks ago (4 children)

I listen to probably at least a dozen new songs every day. If I bought them that would cost me $18/day. Or $540/mo. Not to mention the absolute fortune required to store them all locally.

[–] Powderhorn@beehaw.org 4 points 2 weeks ago (10 children)

I'm in the phase of my life where if I encounter a new track I like in the wild, I'll buy it. But I'm not seeking out new stuff because (cracks open a PBR and grows a goatee) everything feels homogenized today.

Perhaps it's just different use cases. Still, you're dependent on a company to be able to continue listening to the music you like. That's worrisome. If a company took away the collection I've been building since the '80s, livid wouldn't begin to explain my reaction.

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[–] ozoned@piefed.social 10 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Bandwagon, Faircamp, Love a Brother Radio, The Indie Beat. Probably not what you're looking for, but direct creator support, Fedi powered, all wonder folks.

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[–] fjordo@feddit.uk 10 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

I stream with Tidal and for my favourite bands I'll buy their music on 7digital or Bandcamp.

I'd go with Qubuz but they have this whole Qubuz Coin thing that I really don't like. If they removed that I'd switch immediately.

[–] harfang@slrpnk.net 7 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Note that Tidal is owned by Black rocks funds ...which make it very non-ethical platform

[–] fjordo@feddit.uk 6 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

Yeah, unfortunately I don't have much choice at the moment. I refuse support platforms that in my opinion have anti-consumer pricing models, and I want artists to get the most money out of my streams, so it's a bit of a catch-22.

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[–] FatLegTed@piefed.social 8 points 2 weeks ago (4 children)

Why? They have more prog than the others. Believe me, I’d love to stick with Qobuz as the sound quality is magnificent. Unfortunately they just don’t have the music I listen to.

[–] bent@feddit.dk 6 points 2 weeks ago

I had this problem at first, then I realized there's so much music I never listened to before and I have enough new music between Qobuz and Bandcamp that I'm satisfied. But I see your point. I have pirated some music when the creator don't allow me to purchase the songs.

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[–] vga@sopuli.xyz 8 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

Daniel Ek is investing in European defense companies. This is not unethical.

Spotify paying like shit to their artists and platforming Joe Rogan are totally valid reasons to move away though. But the thing is that Spotify is sort of like radio. How much did radio pay for artists for each time the song was played? Genuinely asking.

What I do is I do 90% of my listening on Spotify. Then when I hear something really good, I buy and download their album, usually on Bandcamp and mostly keep listening them on Spotify because it's just so much lesser hassle. Seems like the best of both worlds. Thought about going to vinyls but I'm not hipster enough.

[–] lemmyknow@lemmy.today 4 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

I've started on vinyls. They're cool, but it's some work. Gotta store it right, handle with care, clean them. And that doesn't guarantee it won't skip around or, worse, get stuck on a loop. I do like the big square that is the sleeve cover, and it's just kind of cool. But I've been considering CDs instead. Cheaper, afaik, and can be ripped onto a PC with the right hardware (which I presume is allowed — so long as you don't distribute it — given you pay for it). Cover art is unfortunately smaller, and I've seen some cool vinyl concepts that probably wouldn't work as CDs (colourful? Semitransparent? Glow in the dark????). But far more convenient, and cheaper. Plus, with the right hardware, I could also listen to FM radio

Vinyls are cool, CDs more are convenient (or so I reckon)

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[–] pfr@lemmy.sdf.org 7 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

Can some tell me how Deezer stacks up? I switched from Spotify to Deezer a little while ago, not for any real reason, other than Spotify kept increasing their prices and I don't really listen to audio books or podcasts even. Plus Deezer streams hifi flacs as standard so it sounds way better. I've got no idea how ethical they are tho, but would be interested to learn.

Edit: so I did my own research and looks like Deezer pays sightly more per stream than Spotify, but marginally..

Never mind, I'm beginning to build my local music library and self host it. I buy lots of merch and I go to gigs regularly. Once my library is substantial enough I'll quit the streaming apps

[–] 0x0@lemmy.zip 6 points 2 weeks ago

That's been my take. Buy from the band or their merch whenever possible.
Bandcamp is a close second best, as is HDTracks although they're both from murica.
Otherwise sail the high seas.

I was never a fan of rent music until we stop you anyway.

[–] BuboScandiacus@mander.xyz 6 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)
[–] vga@sopuli.xyz 11 points 2 weeks ago (3 children)

That pays exactly $0 per stream to the artists.

[–] BuboScandiacus@mander.xyz 4 points 2 weeks ago

You can donate to the ones who deserve it and still have access to the drm free music locally

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[–] Scrollone@feddit.it 6 points 2 weeks ago (4 children)

That doesn't solve discoverability of new content, which is one of the good features of Spotify

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[–] BurgerBaron@piefed.social 5 points 2 weeks ago (3 children)

I find Spotify is dogshit to navigate I can't find anything. If I let it autoplay it'll just start playing generic shitty dance music. I don't get it. I've never discovered an artist through Spotify.

I exclusively use Bandcamp lately. Unfortunately, American owned. Looking into other suggestions here.

[–] jerkface@lemmy.ca 5 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (3 children)

Not just any American: Tim Sweeney! I've talked to artists and they have said that there hasn't been any fallout yet. I have to imagine it's just a matter of time if it doesn't manage to buy itself back or something.

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[–] masterspace@lemmy.ca 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

Why?

  1. Lack of Feature Parity

  2. Stickiness of library transfer

  3. Stickiness of social network effects

  4. It's still better ethically than Apple Music or YouTube Music, which behave anti-competitively

1: I've tried out Quobuz, it's pretty good, but it does not have the Jam / Group Session feature which me and my friends use constantly while gaming remotely. It also does not have an Xbox app which I use while playing games. I find Spotify's recommendations somewhat underwhelming, but Quobuz has a noticeably worse recommendation engine, at least for my genres and tastes. Those are the features that lack parity that matter to me, but for some others, it's things like amplifiers having built-in Spotify, or there being a Roku or Playstation app or something.

2: Quobuz uses a third party service to automatically transfer your library, which worked pretty well, but did require jumping through a bunch of hoops and subscribing to a trial subscription that I then had to cancel. It also did not find matches for some songs. Could I make it work if I had enough reason to switch? Yeah, probably, but the lack of feature parity (/roadmap that includes them) is enough to dissuade me from really trying.

3: In addition to friends on Spotify all using Jams, there's also an inherent niceness to just being able to text people Spotify links, especially since there's no cross platform linking service that would otherwise make sharing music easy.

4: Supporting Spotify may not be great, but its still better than supporting trillion dollar anti-competitive corporations like Apple and Google.

[–] rozodru@piefed.social 4 points 2 weeks ago

I prefer to pay artists I like directly either via merch, patreon, or going to their concerts.

for my music? soulseek/nicotine+ on my server.

the problem is Spotify is by far the best streaming platform out there, bar none. I've tried the other's like Tidal and Deezer and what have you and just didn't like them. Amazon Music was absolutely horrible. The only other alternative would be youtube music with an adblocker. How do I find new artists? youtube shorts believe it or not.

But yeah I'd rather pay the artists directly.

[–] ToxicWaste@lemmy.cafe 3 points 2 weeks ago
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