this post was submitted on 21 Apr 2026
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[–] ScoffingLizard@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 17 hours ago (1 children)

Please keep your crazies. We have too many here. Also, if the US takes them, can those of us who don't suck come there and live?

[–] JennyLaFae@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 14 hours ago

I propose an exchange program for the Canadian crazies and US pseudo-refugees to trade citizenships.

Friendly reminder from a yank.. Don't let them manipulate your country too, these people are the same people that caused interference in our elections and want to annex Greenland. There's a reason elons grandfather's "technocracy limited" was banned in Canada around ww2..

[–] phoenixz@lemmy.ca 9 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Its really not that hard to understand. The US wants oil, the end.

Its the reason for what happened in Venezuela

Its the reason why Iran is happening

Its the reason why this shit in Alberta is happening. While the other two went through violence, this is going through spies and AI lies.

Seriously, people behind this should be convicted of treason.

[–] kent_eh@lemmy.ca 2 points 1 day ago

The US wants oil, the end.

Not only oil. Canada has a lot of other resources under the ground that they want as well.

And, of course, all that precious water.

[–] mrdown@lemmy.world 12 points 1 day ago

Of course youtube wilΓ± not remove that or remove the idf chsnnel but they are removing iranian lego videos

[–] moendopi@lemmy.world 2 points 20 hours ago

Look at me, I am surprised! /s

[–] LoveCanada@lemmy.ca 2 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

Im with a lot of Albertans who are (rightly) ticked off at how much our province has been taken advantage of by the east for decades now. We DO want to voice our displeasure (thus the Convoy) and Im uncomfortable but see the necessity of the sabre rattling as a tool for negotiating a fairer deal for Alberta in Ottawa. It's worked for Quebec for years, we're just copying their strategy.

But will separation actually happen? Nope. The clear majority don't support it. Would some in America like it? Sure, they already buy our oil at a huge discount, they would love it if they just owned it all. But you gotta be a whole lot of wingnut to believe that jumping into bed with the shitshow that is the US administration would be in any way better than what we have now. There are definitely some separatists here, but they are a small but loud minority.

Albertans and Quebecois both are and are going to be astroturfed by the US into thinking separatists movements exist with the assistance of Postmedia. Be prepared.

[–] BlameThePeacock@lemmy.ca 28 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Duh. Propaganda is cheap as fuck right now.

[–] UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 7 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Cheap as fuck to buy one-off. Expensive as fuck to fully saturate the market.

My handful of run-ins with online advertising have only sold me more and more on Dead Internet Theory. You really need to unload your wallet if you want a meaningful online presence. Otherwise, you're just pissing down the sewer.

Don't worry, the Yanks hate each other so much, they will turn on each other long before Canada ever does

We actually like each other and know how good we have it

Stay strong hosers

[–] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 10 points 1 day ago (27 children)

Well . . . Yeah. Youtube and everywhere else is swimming with russian bots.

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[–] Karmanopoly@lemmy.world -1 points 1 day ago (3 children)

If you're Canadian and you don't wonder why this isnt the richest society on earth..and that doesn't make you angry..

And then albertans realize most of that wealth is in their back yard... It makes sense why they want to separate. I'd probably want to aswell

[–] melsaskca@lemmy.ca 5 points 1 day ago (2 children)

This is so stupid. Maybe we should create a bunch of independent little Vatican-like countries around each oil well. What a bunch of money and power clowns. The world is moving past all of that and they still haven't figured it out yet.

[–] LoveCanada@lemmy.ca 2 points 1 day ago

'The world is moving past all that' is highly inaccurate. The world still runs on diesel and gas - if it didn't the Strait of Hormuz being blocked wouldn't matter, but it obviously does and the whole world is feeling the pinch right now. We're using and going to use oil for decades to come.

[–] Karmanopoly@lemmy.world -4 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I think the West is just fed up with sending billions back to Ottawa in exchange for nothing.

For example... Ottawa has given away $25.5 billion to Ukraine. Think how many hospitals or walk in clinics that could build nationwide

This is the train of thought of westerners right now

[–] loonsun@sh.itjust.works 7 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

Medical care is a provincial issue, blame your province not the federal government

Also as a Ukrainian Canadian, I don't think you have any idea about how close the two nations are and essentially how many Ukrainians are your neighbours if you live in the west.

[–] LoveCanada@lemmy.ca 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Yes medial care is provincial - but Alberta's beef is that we send billions out east and dont get any of it back. If we didn't have to send it, we could have billions to spend on our own services. Meanwhile other provinces (not mentioning any names, eh, Quebec?) take billions every year while playing the 'have not' province game because they dont count their rich hydro electric as a resource in the equalization formula. We're being gamed and everyone, including Ottawa, knows it but they dont want to piss off Quebecers and lose their votes so they keep this unfair system going.

[–] kent_eh@lemmy.ca 3 points 1 day ago (1 children)

but Alberta's beef is that we send billions out east and dont get any of it back.

Except that pipeline that Trudeau built for Alberta.

Or the health transfers that Trudeau was trying to send to the provinces, but every conservative provincial government rejected it because the feds wanted guarantees that the money would be specifically used for Healthcare and nothing else.

And those are only 2 of the biggest ones in recent years.

[–] LoveCanada@lemmy.ca 2 points 22 hours ago (1 children)

Ok, the use of "any" isn't accurate. We dont get MOST of it back. We send about 20 billion a year more to Ottawa than we get back. Compared to what Ottawa takes, the "gift" of a pipeline isn't exactly altruistic of Ottawa considering the billions in tax revenue it generates.

[–] loonsun@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

Ok, the question though is what do you want from that money? Is there something you find the federal government is obligated to provide but doesn't from the oil money?

[–] LoveCanada@lemmy.ca 1 points 5 minutes ago

Good question. We just want Ottawa to get out of the way and let us do it ourselves. We dont want more funding we just want to not have to send so much of it away that we cant spend what we raise on our own healthcare, education and social programs.

[–] ILikeBoobies@lemmy.ca 3 points 1 day ago

US submission is why. They set it up to steal all our wealth. We ship oil from Alberta to Houston then buy it back after all the value is added.

[–] yogthos@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 day ago (2 children)

Exactly, just look at Norway where they nationalized oil. This could've been us.

[–] AnalogHole@lemmy.blahaj.zone 6 points 1 day ago (1 children)

But the government of Alberta fucked it up. Not Canada.

[–] yogthos@lemmy.ml 3 points 1 day ago (2 children)

I mean there was a fuck up at a national level as well. Canada gutted its publicly owned oil assets and handed the whole show over to private capital. This is a textbook case of neoliberalism doing exactly what it says on the tin.

Back in the 70s and early 80s, there was actually a wave of state intervention. The feds were terrified of American control of our resources, so in 1975 Trudeau created Petro-Canada as a federal Crown corporation. Out west, provinces followed suit with Saskatchewan starting SaskOil in 1973.

But then Mulroney’s PC swept into power in 1984. Mulroney immediately began gutting the nationalist energy policies at the federal level. The process of killing Petro-Canada as a public entity began in 1990 when they sold the first shares to the public. This was an ideologically driven decision.

Alberta absolutely loved the whole privatization wave and by the time Ralph Klein was Premier in the 90s, the province was already deep into deregulation. Alberta had successfully argued that Ottawa should get out of the business entirely and leave it to the free market i.e., the multinationals, and the feds finally sold their last shares in Petro-Canada in 2004.

The federal Liberals under Chretien and Martin finished the job Mulroney started because they had fully adopted Third Way politics . They didn't want to own oil companies and they wanted tax revenue. Meanwhile, Alberta uses the memory of the hated National Energy Program from 1980 as a cudgel to this day. Any time Ottawa tries to regulate emissions or climate change, Alberta screams separation and Ottawa is killing us.

And now the profits are privatized to shareholders and CEOs, while the environmental destruction is socialized onto the public and the planet. Alberta continues to act like a victim of federal overreach while simultaneously demanding that Ottawa build pipelines and bail out the industry whenever prices crash. It's capitalism all the way down. The public built the infrastructure and took the risk and the private sector took the winnings.

I forgot this was lemmy.ml lol now your comment makes much more sense. πŸ’― agree they both sold our soul to the devil.

[–] LoveCanada@lemmy.ca -2 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I was tracking with you til that last paragraph. Alberta does NOT want Ottawa to build pipelines, we want Ottawa to get out of the way and stop blocking them with so many regulations that no company wants to invest here. Billions in investment has fled the province. And if they did build one, they wouldnt be allowed to ship it out because there's a tanker ban on the west coast (which there isn't on the east coast, go figure).

Alberta doesnt ask for bailouts, we just want Ottawa to stop blocking our main resource. We could be supplying the world with tons of LNG if Trudeau hadn't said there's 'no business case' for selling when countries came knocking. Look at where we'd be now if he hadn't been so myopic.

[–] yogthos@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Alberta absolutely does ask for bail outs and cries every time the price of oil drops. Meanwhile, Alberta demanding that we just throw regulations out of the window and destroy the environment to build pipelines on the cheap is the real myopia. If Alberta wasn't just giving oil away to Americans, then Alberta could be rich beyond belief along with the rest of Canada. Instead, Alberta hasn't even bothered investing in domestic refining infrastructure allowing American companies to plunder national resources in Canada.

[–] LoveCanada@lemmy.ca 1 points 22 hours ago (1 children)

You are correct that in 2018, Ottawa gave a $1.6-billion aid package aimed at assisting the oil and gas sector through loan guarantees and investments. Meanwhile, in 2024, Alberta's GDP was approximately 474 billion, a major net contributor to federal finances, providing over 20 billion more in taxes than it receives back in federal spending.

So, if that little 1.6 billion loan/investment was your version of a "bailout every time prices crash" have at 'er, but its obviously not true. We don't need bailouts, we're providing 15% of Canada's overall economic health and we give FAR more to Ottawa than Ottawa gives to us.

[–] yogthos@lemmy.ml 2 points 22 hours ago (1 children)

First off, you are seriously downplaying the bailout history. That $1.6 billion in 2018 was pocket change compared to the COVID era blank check. In 2020, Ottawa bought the Trans Mountain pipeline for $4.5 billion. Then they spent another $9 billion on construction. That is the federal government becoming a pipeline operator because private capital refused to touch it. Then came the $1.7 billion abandonment fund for orphan wells. Then the $15 billion in loan guarantees and tax deferrals. Then the $2.2 billion for methane cleanup. The list goes on and on. The fossil fuel sector has received over $70 billion in public money since 2020 by some estimates. So spare me the little 1.6 billion routine.

Second, the whole net contributor argument is a trick. Yes, Alberta sends more tax revenue to Ottawa than it gets back in transfers. That is literally how a federation works. Ontario also does that. British Columbia also does that. The entire point of equalization is to pool resources so people in PEI and Manitoba can have hospitals and schools. However, Alberta itself benefits massively from that system. The banks, the RCMP, the EI system, and the border security that keeps your exports flowing are all paid for by federal tax dollars that Alberta businesses and workers also use. You think the oil would just magically float to tankers without coast guard icebreakers paid for by everyone?

Third, the oil industry itself is not the net contributor you think it is. Most of those corporate profits leave the country going to Suncor, Cenovus, and Imperial. Their shareholders are in New York, London, and Toronto. The royalty regime in Alberta has always been a joke. Norway saved a trillion dollars from its oil while Alberta saved a big fat nothing. So when you say Alberta provides 15% of Canada's GDP, what you really mean is a handful of multinational corporations extract a non renewable resource, ship the raw bitumen out, keep most of the profit, wreck the land, and then Alberta points to the tax withholding and says look how generous we are.

To sum up, Alberta blew the windfall on tax cuts for the wealthy, and now demands a gold star for paying its bills like every other province.

[–] LoveCanada@lemmy.ca 1 points 21 hours ago (1 children)

In 2020, Ottawa bought the Trans Mountain pipeline for $4.5 billion. Then they spent another $9 billion on construction. That is the federal government becoming a pipeline operator because private capital refused to touch it.

You were lamenting bailouts. BUYING a pipeline and paying Canadians to build it is how construction of a valuable asset works. They didnt lose money on it, and it wasnt a giveaway (A bailout is when Ottawa gives a Bombardier money over and over again because it never stays profitable but they need to keep buying those Quebec votes)

Your second point is weak. Every province benefits from those same federally paid services. But only three provinces pay equalization and get none of it back

2024-2025 Equalization Payments Received (Estimated)

Quebec: ~$13.316 billion ($1,545 per capita)
Manitoba: ~$4.352 billion (approx. $3,000+ per capita)
Nova Scotia: ~$3.284 billion ($3,252 per capita)
New Brunswick: ~$2.897 billion ($3,629 per capita)
Ontario: ~$576 million (or $0 in some formulas)
Newfoundland & Labrador: ~$336 million
Alberta, BC, Saskatchewan: $0 

Your third point has some validity, except for the part about not saving any money for the province. Our Heritage Fund has risen from nearly empty to currently at 30 billion and likely to rise again this year with the oil price surge.

But the oil company shareholders are everywhere, including Canadians and in your CPP retirement fund too. (Its a bit ironic to complain about that when that when our new PM moved Brookfield headquarters to the US to better access American funds). Thats the way international investing works in this world and the way that MOST of the large corporations in Canada operate.

[–] yogthos@lemmy.ml 3 points 21 hours ago

Let's peel back another layer of this neoliberal onion here. You're now moving the goalposts from we never get bailouts to actually buying a pipeline was a smart investment. Let me take these one by one.

You are correct that buying an asset is different from a grant. But here is the problem. The private sector refused to build TMX. Kinder Morgan wanted out because of environmental opposition and cost overruns. So Ottawa stepped in as buyer of last resort. That is a socialist rescue of a failing private project, and the asset is not even finished yet. Current cost estimates have ballooned to over $30 billion while the original estimate was $7 billion. The government will never see that money back. They will sell it at a massive loss to a private consortium years from now, likely one of the same oil companies that refused to build it in the first place. That's just a bailout with extra steps.

And your Bombardier jab is cute but irrelevant. We can criticize Quebec's corporate welfare while also criticizing Alberta's. Two things can be true. The difference is Bombardier builds trains and planes. The oil industry burns the planet. One is a bit more urgent than the other.

Your table is accurate. Alberta, BC, and Saskatchewan pay in and get nothing back. Nobody disputes that. But you are confusing equalization payments with total federal spending. Equalization is just one program. It is not the whole picture.

What about federal infrastructure spending. What about defense contracts. What about the fact that the Canada Pension Plan invests heavily in Alberta oil. What about the massive tax breaks for oil companies embedded in the federal tax code. What about the fact that Ottawa spends billions on cleanup of abandoned wells, a liability that belongs to the provinces.

The equalization formula exists because resource revenues are volatile and uneven. Alberta benefited from that very formula when oil prices crashed in the 80s. Alberta received equalization payments as recently as the 1960s. The story of a perpetual donor province is a very recent invention.

More importantly, the per capita argument cuts against you. Quebec gets less per person than Manitoba or New Brunswick. And the formula is designed to account for provincial capacity to raise revenue. Alberta has the highest GDP per capita in the country by a massive margin. Of course you pay in, that's just mathematics.

You are right that the Heritage Fund is currently around $30 billion, but let's put that number in context. Norway's sovereign wealth fund is over $1.6 trillion and Alaska's Permanent Fund is over $80 billion. Alberta has been pumping oil for over 75 years, and a $30 billion savings account is an embarrassingly small amount of money to show for it. It's basically pocket change being less than a single year of current provincial revenue. If oil vanished tomorrow, that fund would cover about six months of health care spending.

And where did the rest of the money go. It went to tax cuts, corporate subsidies, and low royalty rates. The province chose to hand wealth directly to industry rather than save it.

You are absolutely right that CPP invests in oil. But pointing out that Canadian pensions are entangled with oil extraction is not a defense of the system. It is an indictment of it. The fact that workers' retirement savings depend on burning carbon is precisely the problem. It traps us in a fossil fuel economy even as the world burns.

And your dig about the new PM moving Brookfield to the US. Yes, that is also bad. Neoliberalism hurts everyone eventually. I oppose capital flight and corporate tax avoidance across the board. I do not defend Brookfield just because it is headquartered in Toronto.

Your original claim was that Alberta does not need bailouts because it is a net contributor. But every single downturn proves otherwise. The industry is structurally unstable relying on high prices, export markets, and constant government intervention. The TMX purchase, the orphan well cleanup, the wage subsidies, the loan guarantees. These are all bailouts. They just wear different clothes.

[–] Karmanopoly@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago (1 children)

A few trillion dollar fund is what we could have had.

[–] yogthos@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 day ago
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